ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
You can see the wheels spinning around in their brains. Getting closer...
Conference Realignment
- Status
You can see the wheels spinning around in their brains. Getting closer...
The Galloping Ghost
- Washington, DC
GrayGhost77
- Centennial, CO
Sources: Pac-12, Big Ten, ACC talking alliance
The Pac-12, Big Ten and ACC have had preliminary discussions about forming an alliance, likely built around scheduling but possibly other areas, sources told ESPN.
Big 12 conspicuously absent.
Joel Goodson
- dawgville
Not even remotely a surprise.Sources: Pac-12, Big Ten, ACC talking alliance
The Pac-12, Big Ten and ACC have had preliminary discussions about forming an alliance, likely built around scheduling but possibly other areas, sources told ESPN.www.espn.com
Big 12 conspicuously absent.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
So, the world these three conferences are united in fearing is one where there's a 12-team playoff to which the new SEC becomes understood to be entitled to 5-6 bids, and they become a glorified mid-major level, unable to recruit elite talent with top-level SEC offers anywhere in the country, and thereby less and less appealing to broadcasters.Sources: Pac-12, Big Ten, ACC talking alliance
The Pac-12, Big Ten and ACC have had preliminary discussions about forming an alliance, likely built around scheduling but possibly other areas, sources told ESPN.
Big 12 conspicuously absent.
Which is correct, that is the world we're on a glide path to over the medium term.
The idea here with the scheduling stuff would be that, if these conferences could bind together their elite brands, and have Ohio State, Clemson, USC, etc play one another and NOT the SEC schools in the Atlanta and Dallas and Charlotte neutral site games they otherwise would, the non-SEC world would retain enough gravity to be a counterweight.
Thinking in those terms, the remaining Big 12 teams are refuse, worthless, the unfortunate victims of creative destruction.
As I've been bellyaching about though, this is looking through the wrong end of the telescope. It fails on its own terms, since any strategy that accepts individual football program brand strength as the ultimate force is a game the SEC has already won. You end up in a world of a 12-team playoff in which the SEC gets 6 of the spots anyway, and the chosen few brands from the "alliance" occupy the other 6 permanently. The breakaway college football super league becomes an inevitability before anyone even needs to design it.
The myopia of only being able to view this through the lens of jockeying over playoff expansion is entrenched by the ACC here. The ACC Network is solely owned by ESPN and the conference's first tier rights are locked to ESPN until 2033. They are a puppet regime of the Worldwide Leader. They cannot be part of the resistance, they already belong to the SEC/ESPN conspiracy, even if unintentionally and to their increasing horror.
Anyway, it's not just a question of Kevin Warren and George Kliavkoff being smart enough to come up with the right answer here. The TV money would need to be there to resist ESPN swallowing college sports for themselves. It's a jungle out there in the post-cable bubble world, the suitors might not be there.
But if they are, they will recognize the value of 8 free agents sitting on open real estate in between the two entities strong enough to still fight this thing.
Nuke the playoff. Save college sports.
The world of college football is run by the revenue it can generate, and it's going to go as high as it can, as fast as it can. It's interesting what's happening right now because of all the factors in play that are crumbling the legacy of the sport. It's incredible how many things are changing all at once.
NIL means players can be paid
Media rights at the top tiers have become more and more valuable while the entertainment landscape overall gets more fractured
NCAA's leverage over the conferences has disappeared
Individual programs are rushing to try and position themselves for the best slice of the pie.
The CFP runs until 2025, and will undergo a major overhaul in format to increase its value. There's a ton of pressure to get picked by a surviving conference relatively soon.
I've read a lot of theories on how the conferences will react, but I don't see them being united. Anything's possible, but the premier programs in the ACC and PAC-12 and what's left of the Big12 will be exploring their options individually. Some say the ACC teams are not in play because their media rights run to 2036, but the more I've read on that, the less I think that's an issue. There are several reasons the ACC could essentially fold under a realignment, forcing a renegotiation of those rights. The pressure will be intense, and should either the SEC or BIG find a way to break up the ACC and gain the best properties, it seems much more likely that the better properties break away. For the SEC that's probably Clemson and FSU. For the BIG, that's probably North Car, VT, and possibly GT.
The BIG needs to be proactive. The SEC seems to have the upper hand, but there are a lot of valuable properties out there. We could see 2 super-conferences when it settles, calling the shots on the new playoff, with everyone else playing as outsiders.
Just speculating, but what if the B1G, PAC and ACC all just said, screw you SEC. They form an alliance, a new league, and only play among themselves. 8 team playoff system, 2 teams from each conference guaranteed, 2 wild cards or something like that... if they could find a way to turn this into 4 conferences, it would be perfect. Cross conference scheduling, etc.
SEC may have the best overall brand resume... but without a championship against anyone but themselves, the tarnish would start showing on their brand pretty quickly. Would you rather be champion of the new super league composed of 3 conferences, or would you rather beat up on the same teams year in and year out.
If these 3 conferences really want to play hard ball, convince Texas and Oklahoma to join the new division 1 super league by staying in the B12 and force the SEC to play second fiddle to those 4 conferences who now have a super pact.
That would be true 4D chess.
SEC may have the best overall brand resume... but without a championship against anyone but themselves, the tarnish would start showing on their brand pretty quickly. Would you rather be champion of the new super league composed of 3 conferences, or would you rather beat up on the same teams year in and year out.
If these 3 conferences really want to play hard ball, convince Texas and Oklahoma to join the new division 1 super league by staying in the B12 and force the SEC to play second fiddle to those 4 conferences who now have a super pact.
That would be true 4D chess.
mattcoldagelli
- Script Illinois Enthusiast
@TriangleIL isn’t what you’re describing in the ballpark of what’s being floated? If I’m reading between the lines on this very vague reporting (always a useful exercise, I know), the B1G, ACC and PAC are looking to isolate the SEC. No more non-conference games. Possible lapsing of bowl tie-ins. You do your thing, we’ll do ours, and we’ll see you in the playoff.
That might mean a tense equilibrium for football but it would kind of strangle the non-revenue sports of the SEC. Like, if you keep pulling at this thread, there’s a world in which we don’t play the Braggin Rights game anymore.
That might mean a tense equilibrium for football but it would kind of strangle the non-revenue sports of the SEC. Like, if you keep pulling at this thread, there’s a world in which we don’t play the Braggin Rights game anymore.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
Can I just ask the group, as general viewers of college football, do you want an expanded playoff?
Leave your savvy guy "what the TV networks want is an inevitability, get with the future, man" hats off for a second. Are you interested in watching this?
Leave your savvy guy "what the TV networks want is an inevitability, get with the future, man" hats off for a second. Are you interested in watching this?
From the moment the playoff came about I wanted 8 teams (the Power 5 conference champions, highest rated Group of 5 team, and two highest rated Power 5 teams that didn't win their conference championship).
So yes I want an expansion. But I didn't/don't want 12, and I didn't want it to go the way it seems to be going now.
I don’t really watch it anyway. And probably won’t unless Illinois is involved.
It’s just a yearly re-run of the same teams with a new 4th team mixed in here and there.
While I think the structure could be changed to make it more fair to what used to be the legacy conferences, (add a few wild cards/g5 bid-8 team expansion), I still probably wouldn’t watch much of it without Illinois.
Absolutely. I would like a playoff where every team has a chance to make the playoff, not just Alabama, Clemson, tOSU, Ok, and a few others who get the benefit of the doubt based on the name on the jersey. It seems like most years there are outsiders who can't get in because of the way the playoff works. In addition, I think more games would be interesting if more teams had a chance to make it in.
Do I think an outsider would win it all? Heck no. Juggernauts that get the top recruits are going to continue to dominate in the playoffs. But I still think the season would be better if the playoff was expanded.
People whined when the basketball tournament expanded to 64 teams. People still watched.
People whined when it expanded from 64 to 68. People still watched.
People whined when the football playoff was created. People still watched.
People will whine when the playoff expands to 8. People will still watch.
People will whine when it eventually expands to 12. People will still be watching.
There's your answer.
At the end of the day, there are not enough people that truly adamantly don't want this in order to stop it from happening.
bdutts
- Houston, Texas
Yep. I say include every team that is .500 overall and .500 in their conference.
From the beginning I wanted 8 teams. Didn’t really care how they got the 8, just wanted 8.
No!
But I was content with there being 12 bowls and a bunch of dumb writers voting in the national champion, so what do I know.
Tear it all down to the studs and let’s get Relegation going. The SEC can go do their own thing. Out of spite and desperation the Big 12 pleads to be invited to the cool table with the B1G, PAC-12, ACC Supreme Alliance.
The Bottom 4 from each conference, let’s say, Rutgers, Wake, Oregon St., and Baylor, would play in the farmersonly.com Cups presented by Go Daddy Championship/Kohler Toilet Bowl.
The farmersonly.com Cups presented by Go Daddy Championship would be campus site games. Teams with the better record would get hosting responsibilities. Matchups would be Rutgers vs Wake and Oregon St. vs Baylor. Winners are safe; losers have one more chance at victory in The Kohler Toilet Bowl.
With Relegation there must be some promotion process. The AAC gets volun-told to join as a feeder conference. The AAC football champion gets promoted while the loser of the Kohler Toilet Bowl gets flushed down to the AAC (who are you flushing?).
This would be interesting except for the fact that we would be flirting with your toilet bowl scenario too much.
I was never in favor of college playoffs due to risk for players vs. huge payoffs for executives/universities. I much rather have an alliance and bowls that leaves the SEC out. To relegate the rest of the nation in football and then basketball to second tier staus is BS. SEC can have their champion and a football alliance of BIG, ACC, PAC12, BIG12, Notre Dame, AAC can have their own. Media can decide champion and I'm ok with the debate afterwards. I rather not see Illinois and BIG get MAC status in both football and basketball.
Don't know if you're being serious, but the length of the schedule makes a large playoff difficult. Having everyone give up a regular season game to get a playoff round isn't a great trade off. Ultimately, I think the conference format makes it difficult as well, since some conferences are way stronger than others, and ideally, you give some additional leeway to the conferences to allow more paths to the playoff (and more geographic interest).
bdutts
- Houston, Texas
I was being serious.
How do Div 3 schools do their playoffs? I really don’t know but I do know that they have more than 4 teams.
Edit: Dump the bowls and have the playoffs run into two weeks before the Super Bowl at the latest.
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dgcrow
- Kelso, WA
Don't know about Division III, but the FCS playoffs have 24 teams.
bdutts
- Houston, Texas
That’s better than 4 for sure.
The Galloping Ghost
- Washington, DC
There's the entire month of December that could have playoff games. Pretty much every team's final regular-season game is November 27th. Conference Championship the following week, then selection Sunday, and each week after whittle the playoff field down. This year, the Championship game is on January 11th. You don't really even need to add a week. Now, from a player safety standpoint, there's certainly an argument against it, but from a logistical one, it's not particularly difficult to do. As has been stated, FCS has been doing it for as long as I can remember.
- Status