TSJ Thread

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#376      
The denial of the motion to continue is a good excuse for the prosecutor to dismiss with leave to reinstate, with the result the case is never reinstated. The prosecutor saves face and justice is served.
Please do the “explain to me like I’m five” thing for me here.

My “not a lawyer” interpretation of this is that they can dismiss but reinstate meaning at any time they could bring it back up and charge him again? That would be a pretty terrible thing to have hanging over his head for however long wouldn’t it?

This says “we will dismiss it now but we might come try to get you again in the future”?
 
#377      
Please do the “explain to me like I’m five” thing for me here.

My “not a lawyer” interpretation of this is that they can dismiss but reinstate meaning at any time they could bring it back up and charge him again? That would be a pretty terrible thing to have hanging over his head for however long wouldn’t it?

This says “we will dismiss it now but we might come try to get you again in the future”?
Yes, the prosecution can drop a case and pick it back up later if they ever feel like it. They did the same thing in the Morris case. It's the difference between dropping with or without prejudice.
 
#379      
Paragraphs starting at 6 onwards are where Seiden gets spicy and then his Argument gets heated as well. Some choice statements-

"Specifically, the State is unaware of who initiated the reassignment, who was involved in the decision-making process, and when the decision was made."

"With respect to the State’s suggestion that the trial commence on June 12th, the court found that any number of issues could cause additional delay and so the trial would just begin on June 10th."

"it would be unreasonable to expect to prepare of a case of this magnitude in less than one week."

"It should be noted that the defendant in this matter has enjoyed continuous representation from the same three (3) attorneys. One of these attorneys suggested to the court that the District Attorney should be competent to complete the trial in Case No. 2023-CR-000261. In adopting that finding, this court has now allowed the defense to dictate the manner in which the State tries a completely unrelated case that is not even before this court."
 

Attachments

  • Motion to Reconsider Motion for Continuance.pdf
    150 KB · Views: 105
#381      

the national

the Front Range
Paragraphs starting at 6 onwards are where Seiden gets spicy and then his Argument gets heated as well. Some choice statements-

"Specifically, the State is unaware of who initiated the reassignment, who was involved in the decision-making process, and when the decision was made."

"With respect to the State’s suggestion that the trial commence on June 12th, the court found that any number of issues could cause additional delay and so the trial would just begin on June 10th."

"it would be unreasonable to expect to prepare of a case of this magnitude in less than one week."

"It should be noted that the defendant in this matter has enjoyed continuous representation from the same three (3) attorneys. One of these attorneys suggested to the court that the District Attorney should be competent to complete the trial in Case No. 2023-CR-000261. In adopting that finding, this court has now allowed the defense to dictate the manner in which the State tries a completely unrelated case that is not even before this court."
lol, Enjoyed?! Give me a break.
 
#383      
This must be a blast from the past for Judge Hanley. Once again she's being accused by the DA's office of failing to properly inform them of something. Last time it was the jury trial COVID safety protocol where the DA threatened prosecutors just wouldn't show up to their trials. It would be best for Seiden if he remembered how that went for his boss, who he had to defend in the hearings.
 
#384      
This must be a blast from the past for Judge Hanley. Once again she's being accused by the DA's office of failing to properly inform them of something. Last time it was the jury trial COVID safety protocol where the DA threatened prosecutors just wouldn't show up to their trials. It would be best for Seiden if he remembered how that went for his boss, who he had to defend in the hearings.
These legal maneuvers by the prosecution appear to be state sponsored extortion to extract a plea bargain because of the time sensitive nature of this case.
 
#385      
I think that you are misreading. The scheduling issue is the excuse to drop the case and never pick it up, because the prosecutor doesn't want to actually prosecute the case. He doesn't think that he can win.
I get it. It would be a copout from a prosecutor who thinks he can't win. But it's too late for that. If he thinks he can't win, justice demands that he dismiss the case. If he thinks there's any chance of winning, justice demands that he give both the accuser and TSJ their chance to get a resolution.
 
#386      
These legal maneuvers by the prosecution appear to be state sponsored extortion to extract a plea bargain because of the time sensitive nature of this case.
As a lawyer, I do not see where the State's request is outlandish or for nefarious reasons. Another case was delayed during trial causing a conflict for counsel. Stuff happens and courts generally try to work around it. I haven't followed the procedural stuff in this case, but unless the delay to June 12 would cause other scheduling issues for the court and other attorneys - basically allowing the proposed delay of this trial to cascade into numerous other scheduling issues - this is a request that would be routinely granted. If no other scheduling issues, maybe this judge just wants to screw with the DA, and this assistant got caught in the crossfire. Or maybe it is a little of both.
Where is the speculation about them dropping the case coming from - is that being discussed by the DA;s office?
 
#389      
Even given the intense scrutiny people on this thread have devoted to what is going on in the Kansas courts, and it is truly impressive how much has been learned, it is impossible to really understand the relationship between the DAs office and the courts without sitting in the courtroom over a period of time. We don’t know whether the court feels misled by representations by the DAs office in other cases, which may have led to the denial of the motion to continue in this case. As much as judges try to forget a lawyer’s behavior in other cases when addressing issues in the case before the court, to a certain extent it cannot be helped. If, in similar situations the court felt the DAs office repeatedly played fast and loose with their representations, those feelings are going to leak into the case currently pending. Something or many somethings has poisoned the relationship between the DAs office and the judges in that courthouse. I spent 40 years in courtrooms and never witnessed the kind of relationship that appears to exist between the prosecutors and the courts in that courthouse, a relationship that is appears to exist between the prosecutors and at least two judges. One judge, yes. Two judges, never.
 
#390      

IlliniKat91

Chicago, IL
Even so, the connotation of using”enjoyed” in this context/case/situation is awful, and seems deliberately nasty…
Reading it as an English teacher, it's the secondary definition as stated above. There's nothing nefarious in its use. It's just not part of the common parlance and feels off since most of us wouldn't use the word that way.
 
#391      
Reading it as an English teacher, it's the secondary definition as stated above. There's nothing nefarious in its use. It's just not part of the common parlance and feels off since most of us wouldn't use the word that way.
Semantics matter of course. Nonetheless, the assistant DA comes off as a self-righteous ... well, you know. The vibe by now is clear.
 
#392      
Reading it as an English teacher, it's the secondary definition as stated above. There's nothing nefarious in its use. It's just not part of the common parlance and feels off since most of us wouldn't use the word that way.
If anything, I found the statement itself to be mildly offensive, not the wording. The statement that "the defendant in this matter has enjoyed continuous representation from the same three (3) attorneys" is to elicit sympathy for the prosecution only having one prosecutor, when the State only has itself to blame because so many employees have fled Valdez. Also big picture- he has three attorneys defending him from going to prison and losing his future career, are we to hold it against him, that other poor defendants might be stuck with just one or two defense attorneys?
 
#393      
As a lawyer, I do not see where the State's request is outlandish or for nefarious reasons. Another case was delayed during trial causing a conflict for counsel. Stuff happens and courts generally try to work around it. I haven't followed the procedural stuff in this case, but unless the delay to June 12 would cause other scheduling issues for the court and other attorneys - basically allowing the proposed delay of this trial to cascade into numerous other scheduling issues - this is a request that would be routinely granted. If no other scheduling issues, maybe this judge just wants to screw with the DA, and this assistant got caught in the crossfire. Or maybe it is a little of both.
Where is the speculation about them dropping the case coming from - is that being discussed by the DA;s office?
I don't think this is based upon any material fact or statement. I think it's merely conjecture by some that if the state feels that preparation cannot result in a conviction on their end the professional course of action is to dismiss the case without prejudice.

In practice I agree that these requests are normally granted; however I believe the American criminal justice system has developed a very loose interpretation of the right to a speedy trial in modern times. In this situation, I have no sympathy for the prosecutor claiming that additional time may be needed for a "case of this magnitude" because the magnitude is merely based on who the defendant is. All cases should be presented with the utmost of preparation in the eyes of justice.
 
#396      

the national

the Front Range
If anything, I found the statement itself to be mildly offensive, not the wording. The statement that "the defendant in this matter has enjoyed continuous representation from the same three (3) attorneys" is to elicit sympathy for the prosecution only having one prosecutor, when the State only has itself to blame because so many employees have fled Valdez. Also big picture- he has three attorneys defending him from going to prison and losing his future career, are we to hold it against him, that other poor defendants might be stuck with just one or two defense attorneys?
I agree whole heartedly with your take - that’s how I felt when I read it myself.

A man, fighting for his name and his innocence, should have the right to council. Im sure The Prosecutor won’t enjoy taking on those three attorneys in battle. I have no sympathy for that DA or prosecutor.
 
#397      

IlliniKat91

Chicago, IL
If anything, I found the statement itself to be mildly offensive, not the wording. The statement that "the defendant in this matter has enjoyed continuous representation from the same three (3) attorneys" is to elicit sympathy for the prosecution only having one prosecutor, when the State only has itself to blame because so many employees have fled Valdez. Also big picture- he has three attorneys defending him from going to prison and losing his future career, are we to hold it against him, that other poor defendants might be stuck with just one or two defense attorneys?
As biased as I am in favor of TSJ and as much as I want this resolved with him being cleared to go to the NBA and live the life he's always dreamed of, I think a lot of folks here are reading these documents with orange-tinted glasses in place.

It's not unreasonable when asking the date to be moved to point out the larger caseload the DA's office has compared to the attorneys working a single case. Just like it's not unreasonable for the judge to say tough, figure it out when denying that request.

He made a point he thought would be compelling and lost. I think it's as simple as that and there's no use being offended by it, but you do you.
 
#398      
Defense moves to admit Morris evidence. Some bullet points but really the whole thing is a great read-

- There is video evidence of Shannon and the others present at the bar - "identified third-party defendant who is alleged to have committed a similar sexual assault in the same location less than two weeks prior to the alleged assault in Mr. Shannon’s case and who was present (as evidenced by video) within a couple feet of the precise location of the alleged touching in the case at bar."

- Morris was standing next to Kevin McCullar, not Shannon. This is important as the alleged victim has testified that it was Shannon next to Kevin McCullar. I don't know how this works with the picture of Harmon and Shannon she sent to the police saying Harmon was standing next to Shannon cough white girl can't tell black men apart cough - "M.N. would later testify at preliminary hearing that one of those witnesses was immediately next to Mr. Shannon while Mr. Shannon was allegedly assaulting her. However, video surveillance reveals that the person who was immediately next to the witness was, in fact, the third party in question."

- Seiden says no relation between one bar assault and another - "Undersigned counsel indicated their belief that information related to the 8/26/23 bar assault was known to police but had not been part of the charges or the media coverage thereof." "counsel for the State indicated that the State would not agree to produce reports to the defense, even under a protective order, because of his belief that the two incidents were in no way similar."

- Bullet point 12 spans multiple paragraphs and the Defense rips into Seiden, all good stuff, too much to quote

The Argument and Authority section:

- Morris, not Shannon "Video evidence reveals that Mr. Shannon was not the person immediately next to KM. Instead, the person in that position was the third party at issue here. Multiple witnesses can testify as to the presence of the third party in this location at the time of the alleged touching. Police have never interviewed the third party about his presence at the bar or specifically in the area of this alleged assault."

- Morris might be aware the area doesn't have good camera coverage "Four days later, L.R. reported the incident to police who reviewed footage from the bar’s surveillance cameras and confirmed that the third party was in the area she had described but they could not see the touching due to his location, the camera angle, and the crowd of people."

- Because Morris committed a rape, either the police or the D.A. decided not to pursue the earlier sexual assault charge that sounds like it would have been a winner "Police interviewed an eyewitness (M.R.) who had seen the touching. Police did not contact the third party about this incident until September 11, 2023, two days after the incident in our case. Police prepared a probable cause affidavit on September 15, 2023. They prepared a second probable cause affidavit on the same date related to a separate allegation. The third party was charged with rape based upon the second affidavit. No charges were filed related to the alleged touching in the bar."
 

Attachments

  • Motion to Admit Evidence of Third Party Defendant.pdf
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#399      
As biased as I am in favor of TSJ and as much as I want this resolved with him being cleared to go to the NBA and live the life he's always dreamed of, I think a lot of folks here are reading these documents with orange-tinted glasses in place.

It's not unreasonable when asking the date to be moved to point out the larger caseload the DA's office has compared to the attorneys working a single case. Just like it's not unreasonable for the judge to say tough, figure it out when denying that request.

He made a point he thought would be compelling and lost. I think it's as simple as that and there's no use being offended by it, but you do you.
I view this more as an example of a larger problem with the justice system. If I were in the shoes of either the victim or the defendant, and all the attorneys agree to a trial date, then one of them later says "oh, now I'm too busy and my colleague is incapable of handling our other cases so I want to push this trial back and screw up everyone else's schedules, and btw I might try to do this for another 5 months..", then I might be a little offended and view that as irresponsible.

Now if Seiden had presented a valid reason to push the trial back (i.e. new evidence has come to light that we need time to process), then it would be reasonable to consider delaying. But his argument here is essentially that the DA office mismanaged their time/resources and somehow that's the judge's fault. That's ridiculous and the fact that there are DA's out there pulling this garbage at the expense of victims' wellbeing is a bit of an offensive thought to me.
 
#400      
Defense moves to admit Morris evidence. Some bullet points but really the whole thing is a great read-

(snip)

The Argument and Authority section:
...
- Morris, not Shannon "Video evidence reveals that Mr. Shannon was not the person immediately next to KM. Instead, the person in that position was the third party at issue here. Multiple witnesses can testify as to the presence of the third party in this location at the time of the alleged touching. Police have never interviewed the third party about his presence at the bar or specifically in the area of this alleged assault."
Shannon's attorneys summarize the victim's original testimony as including the claim that four people (including victim, Shannon and Harmon) were standing with their backs to the same wall in a corner. That wall, counsel says is 26.5" wide, which would make it difficult for two, let alone four people to stand with their backs to it.
And Shannon was with McCullar, not Harmon. At least I think that is counsel's position.
 
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